Redstate

"I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it." --George Bernard Shaw

seems to have the witch hunt mentality to it.

The post hires a young, conservative blogger the left doesn't like, so they start looking for an angle.

At this point I have a hard time giving too much concern to the plagerism stuff, because I have already every other par for the course left attacked tossed his way.

I also admit I can't get all that up in arms over mostly movie reviews done for a college paper.  I could probably get upset, if it was something actually done during the current gig, or the charges had already existed for months, but at this point the left just looks like a bunch of toddlers throwing tantrums to get their way.

isnt Russert (da god of the sun morning junk), Steph, Matthews and I'm sure a cast of thousands, former politicians, aides, appointees, whatever?  They're hopeless.

Michelle Malkin has turned on "young Ben", (as she calls him), and says he should own up to his mistakes and STEP DOWN) ..

Michael

but what should we have expected from these malcontents, other than that they would conduct themselves on this issue as they do towards any other issue they can neither control nor dismiss?

Absolute control of the media (in all forms), control of academia and the entertainment industries - all of which form - perspectives, attitudes and build opinions - are the sacrosanct 'rights' of the left.

These are the only 'rights' that count.  Ben's right to work for the Post, the Post's right to engage Ben, and any other right belonging to anyone else not absolutely under the left's control - are targets for dismantle.

The sounds of wolves howling out there in the snowy darkness all too often become, upon closer investigation, the mere yelps and mewlings of carrion-eaters who long ago lost all their teeth - save the one used for nipping at the heels of their betters; and for self-destruction.

Go get 'em, Ben.  It's open season on cowards, ingrates, bushwackers and petty tyrants.

Ben has been called a homosexual?  So what!  Doesn't the left believe in equal rights and if so why is this an issue and how does it matter.  Wait, is it possible that just beneath the surface they don't believe what they say, that they are insincere, that they are posturing, that they are full of ----.  I wonder if all their so called beliefs are so false, like for example that right that heads the Pantheon of rights, free speech. It might be possible that that they don't believe in anything, that they are a vacuun of ideas and principles.  Gee, that would make any debate with such filth a little difficult wouldn't it?  As well as cause you to wonder if the only things that matter to them are power and oppression, even if they are only cheering spectators in the bleachers of life.  

She forgot that you cannot give-in to terrorists - it's just emboldens them.

The left-blogland is simply no different.

Plus she appears to have jumped to conclusions and is wrong on the facts, again.

Pity.

And I personally cannot stand when the left (or anyone) levels attacks against or brings up one's family into a discussion where they do not belong, but my question is, some of the plagiarisms look pretty bad are they true?  If they are true, then maybe for that reason alone, he should recommend another redstater to take his place.

Decency is a slippery word.  We know what we mean by it, but the Tourette's convention that is the left (streiff) does not.  To them, decency is just a weak attempt on our part to complain that our old-fashioned ways are no longer mainstream.  They are wrong on both counts, and they will alway be wrong on those counts.

Decency is a universal, inescapable, self-reinforcing bedrock on which rests civilization.  It is "the quality of conforming to standards of propriety and morality".  Even granting, for the sake of argument, that those are relative terms, we can say "propriety and morality" in the simplest way are "acting in consideration of others".

Without acting in consideration of others, there can be no dialogue.  There is only the personal attack and hatred of other groups, turning discourse into an epithetical arms race.  

The Tourettists and their allies, the terrorists, believe that they have a superior command of the arts of war, because we are bound by honor not to engage in their tactics.  Let us not free ourselves from those bonds while showing them otherwise.

She forgot that you cannot give-in to terrorists - it's just emboldens them.

The left-blogland is simply no different.

Since we're all about decrying the cheapening of terms like racist and fascist, let's be consistent and avoid casually slinging loaded terms like terrorist around as well, shall we? I sympathize with and share the frustration at the excesses of some on the left, but better to step above that sort of thing. Malkin pretty clearly condemns the motivations of the horde but is concerned about the facts that they've uncovered.

Anyway, I pick Ben over Malkin any day. Dunno how this plagiarism stuff will shake out, and frankly I do think it needs to be addressed, but I look forward to continuing to read Ben's work.

 

I'm a very minor poster here, and yet I'm impulsively driven by my own ethics to eschew plagiarism at all times. We are the folks who claim to live more honorably and play by the rules. We complain bitterly about the collapse of honor and decency in society. Given that, the right take here is:

1.  Bravo machiavel, your points are well taken. The unhinged actions of the left are, as usual, unacceptable.
   
2.  Bravo Ben for your brave and thoughful commentary on conservative issues. I'm certain that the overwhelming majority of your words have been your own.
   
3.  Ben, you should resign and apologize.

I blame the WaPo as much as anybody else. They had to know that Ben would be scrutinized, and yet, as is all too common in journalism these days, they failed to scrutinize for themselves. On that same thought, I have to do a little "shame on Ben" here, too. Clearly, there was a lot at stake here. The fallout from this will be damaging to the conservative movement.

Every conservative comes to know that conservatives are held to a dramatically higher standard than liberals. It's just the way the game is played. Ben knows that, too, I suspect, and should hold himself accountable for failing to live up to that admittedly higher bar.

I personally wouldn't dare, given the amount of vitriol that would inevitably descend upon me - and more importantly, my wife and/or my parents.

And, yes, that is precisely the depths to which people have sunk in this.

A nomination for the Federal judiciary comes to mind.

The character assassins must be defeated. Completely and utterly defeated.

Maybe so, but I have a sinking feeling that this was what the CBS brass initially concluded about the 'unhinged attacks' on Dan Rather's credibility. Maybe there were some unhinged attacks, but the reality is that the substantive attacks were all that mattered.

Don't make the same mistake as CBS execs, who burned through their credibility while defending themselves from attacks they thought were unhinged but actually had some substance.

Ben get a job?

If he did it, apologize, but the reality I see here, is that the left gets what they want, the ability to attack to the point the those on the right will happily eat their own-we are giving the left veto power over who gets to have a voice on the conservative side.

I could maybe join you in your call, but for two things-this was maybe the 8th or 9th line of attack, after attacking him personally-his family, his faith, his sexuality, etc.

I would also join you, if the indescretions occured while he was currently working in his current position.

No brendan, I was not playing the left-blogland == terrorist game - that's not my bag.

What I was saying is that Michelle's surprisingly childish notion that giving-up Domenech would do anything other than embolden the left-blogland to crave more scalps is precisely the reason we don't give-in to terrorists.

Give in to terrorists?  Get more terrorism.

Give in to the Fire Domenech! kabal?  Domenech will be only the first.

That's all.

Count on me to rip to shreds anyone who goes ad-hom on you or yours like that.

I suspect most of the ObWi crew would be fighting for their place in line to do the same.

You're still thought of quite highly in many circles, you know. Even if you are dead wrong about almost everything except RPGs and sci-fi. ;)

..."Marching Through Georgia" in an Atlanta bar.

Oh, wait: must attribute (Terry Pratchett), lest the Left decides that they don't want me getting that new job ten years down the line.

If leftists believe their own arguments about plagiarism, why is Newsweek pumping Joe Biden for President?

Oh, wait, Biden is a Democrat.  Never mind.

L.W. Pressman

But we are not homophobes, we are exposing the hypocrisy of right-wight biggots who are willing to exploit differently attracted genders for their own evil purposes. This good not only for those of conscience like ourselves, it causes the right wing biggots to fight amonst themselves, it can also convert those who believe that their enemies are their friends. For one example, see David Brock, and Confessions of an Ex-Conservative. This book demonstrates the rightness of our cause!

Channelling Ends.

L.W. of course is a former spokesman for left-wing causes who occassionally provides me insight into their brand of anti-thinking. I hope this helps your understanding.

From:

Conservatives Turn on New 'Wash Post' Blogger, Urge Him to Step Down

By E&P Staff

Editor&Publisher

March 24, 2006 12:30 PM ET

http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_conten
t_id=1002236059

NEW YORK A two-day effort by liberal bloggers to find, and publicize, numerous examples of plagiarism committed by new Washington Post blogger Ben Domenech culminated today in calls that he give up his new position--from some of his conservative supporters.

One of them, most dramatically, is columnist and blogger Michelle Malkin. As an editor at Regnery, Domenech handled her most recent book.

[...]

Some of the cases occurred while Ben was in college; he is blaming an editor for these transgressions. But at least one other incident involved a piece he wrote for NRO after he graduated. The side-by-side comparisons of these extensive passages is damning.

"I certainly understand the impulse on the Right to rally around Domenech. But I can't ignore the plain evidence. And the charges can't be dismissed as 'lies' or jealousy attributed to Ben's age. As someone who has worked in daily journalism for 14 years, I have a lot of experience related to this horrible situation: I've had my work plagiarized by shameless word and idea thiefs many times over the years. I've also been baselessly accused of plagiarism by some of the same leftists now attacking Ben.

"The bottom line is: I know it when I see it. And, painfully, Domenech's detractors, are right. He should own up to it and step down. Then, the Left should cease its sick gloating and leave him and his family alone."

Another conservative blogger, Rick Moran, wrote today that "what simply cannot be tolerated in any venue where the written word is revered and opinions respected is plagiarism. And according to material dug up by several lefty bloggers, the shocking fact seems to be that Domenech is a word stealer of epic proportions, someone who has lifted entire articles from other sources and claimed the words and ideas as his own....

"With so many eloquent and able conservative writers, I'm sure the Post will have no problem finding someone else to take over a blog that should be espousing honesty and decency as the principles by which we on the right live by.

"Anything short of that just won't do."

More than likely they're trying to turn away potential supporters by pressing a Conservative hot-button.

I don't know Ben, and until earlier this week I frankly had no idea who he is. Clearly having been given a microphone at the Washington Post the left have rallied their forces and fired volley after volley at him, the vast majority of it simply vitriol and ad hominem attacks. Basically that's what large segments of the unhinged left are comfortable with; it's the individualized version of 'if you can't win at the ballot box use the courts.' We see it every day in the attacks on George Bush culminating in the current, focus-group-approved, "incompetent" label.

Most reasonable people, and hopefully the management of the Washington Post can still number some of their management among that group, will recognize the attacks for what they are and dismiss them. The directors of RedState have seemingly 'bet the farm' on defending him and that's their right. Many, if not all, of the RedState directors are personal or professional friends of his and it is a good thing to rally to the defense of a friend.

But there is the big one, the fairly impersonal, charge of plagiarism. I've seen various comments mostly centering on the idea that Ben was just a kid when that happened and 'kids say the darnedest things'; these defenses may well be true I have no real way to know. Any of us who have kids, or have been kids, know that 'the very young do not always do as they are told' and to some degree this is an acceptable explanation.

As I said I don't know the man. But a lot of people that I have come to respect over my past year on RedState do know him and defend his integrity; that must mean he's an honorable man and will do the honorable thing when the time occurs. And, my respect for them and their defense of him, I will join them and stand on the wall next to him. But I'd really like to hear his side of the only substantive part of the charges, plagiarism. The rest of it is just so much angry left lunacy.

I hope that he will take the time to explain  his side of the story to his new found friends and supporters here on RedState. In another context Thomas Jefferson said that "...a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the cause ..."

Talk to us Ben.

We as conservatives take the high ground.  Ben should at the very least apologize for the plagiarism and possibly resign, because, as conservatives, we must always take the high ground and not be seen as hypocrites.  The left is full of hypocrites and thus have no problem when these things happen with their guys, we however, must push for the highest standards universally applied.

"Red America" will be abandoned. Therefore signaling a defeat for the forces of truth in the media.

I'm not particularly sure what sort of obsessive losers the left has, because it sounds like they were putting every sentence he wrote into Google.

This will happen when the guns of George Soros and the left are turned on someone.

Either you fight, or you surrender.

And if you surrender, then the Soros-funded left will continue their reign of terror against the right.

I think Ben is obviously quilty of plagiarism, and ignoring the issue for any reason is typical lefty tripe that I certainly won't tolerate.  Plagiarism is wrong, yet there are mitigating factors:  he didn't steal others ideas as much as lazily use mundane descriptive passages, and it's entirely possible he didn't knowingly use others words but simply wrote what he was conscious of (even though it was because someone else wrote it).  This is not "right," but not severe enough for him to step down.

The personal attacks against him again illustrate the idiocy of some on the right:  DON'T ENGAGE WITH MOONBATS.  You should know by now you can't make them see our points and will never be able to convince them of anything they don't already believe in.  Why respond to someone who disgraces themselves by hurling ad hominem attacks?  It will only drag you down. See some Eastern philosophy about this type of thing.  Have some confidence in yourself.  Look at Richard Perle's response to George Galloway and act similiar to Perle.

There are, however, many people in the middle who look for stimulating debate and are worthy of talking to, if nothing else in order to solidify the rationale of oneself.  These people deserve to hear this blog say Ben should do what's politically smart and simply ignore the issue while ensuring no future problems related to plagiarism, but with the caveat that Ben might have been too loose with his writing at some points in his young life.

...or does it seem that Michelle is slowly falling into the moonbat pit she so recently wrote about?

While it appears Ben is indeed guilty of plagiarism and should step down, before he is fired, has anyone let it run through their mind if WAPO set him up.  

You have to think they did some research into his work, I mean, if it all it took was some google searches and comparisons to his writing, you would think they were aware of these instances ..

Michael

for it that you did not intend a direct comparison to terrorists, but I'm not so sure it would have been entirely inappropriate if you had.

Terrorists are seeking to use terror to control society at large. The variety we are currently at war with have a penchant for generating that sort of terror through grotesque physical violence. But that is not the only sort of terror one can generate. In fact, it is arguably a weaker form of terrorism than  purely emotional or psychological terror. Physical terrorism can be confronted and defied as did one brave Italian who was beheaded by the physical terrorists. But just look at Moe's comments below. One could make the case that he and others like him are reasonably terrified to take a similar positions because of the kinds of attacks that have been launched against other conservatives and their families. So it can be a type of terrorism as well, and therefore as deserving of our work to confront and destroy it.

I do understand the points you and the previous poster were making: we associate a greater level of evil some terms, and to associate those terms with lesser evils devalues their usefulness in language. If this were an isolated instance I would agree whole-heartedly with your position. And while I'm not 100% you are wrong, I think you also need to consider that to a great extent, this is not an isolated instance, but standard operating procedure, and perhaps therefore closer to the greater evil than the lesser. Although I will conceed I'm not quite sure they are the same just yet.

you're correct. Michelle has been sliding for a while though (haven't had her site book marked in a while myself)

if the WaPo was in on this in order to try and smear the right.

But, it would take an incredible effort to find so many "examples" of plagirism.

Such an effort could only be concievably undertaken by Soros employees. I guarantee that if you look into the major players on the left in this, they are all employed by George Soros.

down.

This stuff, if true, didn't happen within the context of his current job, and mostly happened withing the context of a college newspaper.  It also happened mostly with regard to more "fluff" type pieces, and didn't really involve major academic works.  

If he did it, an apology is in order, but I am not sure we should declare somebody unable to be employed in this capacity.

Seems to me that the GOP is entirely too good at falling into the lefts traps and eating our own.  The left turns the dogs loose, and the GOP like good dogs, joins the pack, and tears up the target for them.  We are essentially giving the left veto power.  

For the same reason that Helen Keller should not have stopped writing.

Now's not the time for me to discuss them.  I will later.

for plaigerism.  If you are in a profession where your stock in trade is the production of original ideas, using  someone elses ideas and words without attribution is one of the most heinous professional offenses you can commit.  Saying you were in college isn't good enough.  College students should know better.  I think the proper punishment for plaigerism in College is expulsion.

he should resign from the College Newspaper immediately.  Wait a second!  He doesn't write for them anymore.  Does anyone seriously think the WaPo hired him because of his movie reviews in a college newspaper, or because of what he has accomplished since then?

I mean its not like he ridiculed the grisly murder and dismemberment of US contractors risking their lives to improve the quality of life for Iraqis.

I think he should apologize for not more appropriately citing sources (He didn't copy ideas, just some descriptive phrases) and get on with his job.

The KOSLosers should get a life.  

I feel for Ben Domenech:  he has suffered a very public humiliation and may very well lose his new job.  But this is ridiculous.  The fact that certain lefty bloggers attacked him on six or seven baseless grounds before they found a charge that stuck tells us quite a bit about those lefty bloggers; at the end of the day, however, it does not refute the charge.  

RedState has offered a noble defense of Ben, but there are other issues.  It is time to move on and let the chips fall where they may.  

Remember she was after John Lott for a while about alleged fabrications and phony statistics in his books, as well as some rather bizarre impersonations he was alleged to have done.

quite a few of us feel otherwise and rather strongly. Friends aren't chips.

Sorry guys, but I think Ben's goose is just about ready to come out of the oven.  It's fine to defend him against the absurd stuff, some of which was truly disgusting.  Let's go after the moonbats who spread it.  But the plagiarism issue looks very real, and it does not seem like we can laugh it off on the basis of the accusers having been wrong before.

(Who has all the best software for finding plagiarism? College professors--definitely the bluest of the bluestaters. Not Ben's friends.)

From:

Final Fantasy: The Spirits Within

by Steve Murray, Cox News Service

Grand Junction (Colorado) Daily Sentinel

http://www.gjsentinel.com/movies/content/shared/movies/reviews/F/finalfanta
sy.html

excerpt:

Translucent and glowing, they ooze up from the ground and float through solid walls, wriggling countless tentacles and snapping their jaws. They're known as the Phantoms, alien thingies that, for three decades, have been sucking the life out of the earthlings of "Final Fantasy: The Spirits Within." Swollen nightmares from a petri dish, they're the kind of grotesque whatsits horror writer H.P. Lovecraft would have kept as pets in his basement.

From:

Are You Game?

Geek diversions don't necessarily transfer to the big screen.

By Ben Domenech

National Review Online, July 14-15, 2001

http://www.nationalreview.com/weekend/movies/movies-domenech071401.shtml

excerpt:

Translucent and glowing, they ooze up from the ground and float through solid walls, splaying their tentacles and snapping their jaws, dripping a discomfiting acidic ooze. They're known as the Phantoms, otherworldly beings who, for three decades, have been literally sucking the life out of the earthlings of the human. They are swollen, insectoid, the nightmare descendents of Lovecraftian grotesque -- if only the filmmakers had created a plot that was as memorable.

The fastest way for a conservative/Republican to get favorable MSM coverage is to attack another conservative/Republican.

I agree with Just Me above.  We should love the sinner and hate the sin.  This is a difficult thing to do, when push of theory runs up against the shove of reality.  Nonetheless, we are not only commanded to do so, but it is in our own best interest (ye without sin cast the first stone and all that jazz).

I too join in the chorus of responsibility, though not in the implicit conservative superiority/purity "ideal" attributed to the body politic, which has been amazingly absorbed and regurgitated back out by many conservatives themselves.  It is not ordained or healthy that anyone or any group to think itself higher than another.

The merits of our ideals stand on their own.  It is the measure of our character and salvation how we adhere to them, in good times and bad.  Of course, we must remember our forgiven enemies, in our final decision.

Ben deserves the opportunity to defend himself.  If wrongdoing has occurred, an apology would be appropriate - both regarding plagiarism and sullying the conservative movement.  However, the punishment should match the severity of the crime (which does not appear to be severe in this case, though it's historical pervasiveness may require a time in the wilderness to properly repent).  This is not about judgment (different department for that duty).  This is about the ability to fulfill one's duties in society.

I (have) and could respect a conservative voice that was not perfect (Bill Bennett anyone?), had made amends, reiterated his fealty to the straight course, and continued to perform a vital service.  To put it another way, has anyone out there ever been in a car accident?  Has your driving improved since then?  Whether your answer is yes or no, should your license to drive have been revoked?

Pain is part of life.  My moral evaluation structure is clear.  The path of this issue's political resolution however will be greatly influenced by Ben's actions in the near-term.  Love the sinner and hate the sin.

looking up to Martin Luther King Jr then?  He plagiarized in college, does this make him less important, less worthy, should we determine that his leadership meant nothing?

I suspect a heck of a lot of people plagiarized in college, some on purpose, some inadvertently.  

Should those caught be held accountable within the context of the writing?  Yes, but I think there are several college proffessors out there who plagiarized and they still have their jobs.  

I agree with your thoughts, but not your spelling. If Mr. Domenech is guilty, and only he knows for sure, he should apologize and resign. If he did what he seems to have, we will all be tarred with the same brush by association.

1. WAPO set him up
   
   
2. Lefties assasinated his character
   
   
3. He was just a kid
   
   
4. They were only fluff pieces
   
   
5. Its not his fault

...these are just some of the excuses I've read in these comments about him.  You sound like appolgists to me.  I gotta hand it to the right, you guys definately stick to your guns even when you KNOW its wrong.  The democrats tend to bolt as so as something is even questionable (look how they reacted to Russ Fiengolds very reasonable centure motion).

He wasn't writing academic papers for a class.  He wasn't even writing super important pieces in the paper, they were fluff pieces for the most part (not to be offensive).

But it seems like calls for an apology if charges are proved right are in order, but calls for him to be fired are rediculous.  

You're right that the "netroots" were out to destroy Mr. Domenech from the get-go.  But he gave them the weapon.

I know that if it weren't the plagiarism, it would be something else.  But the plagiarism charge is solid, and it will stick.  Particularly given what he said about Mr. Blair and the the New York Times.

The "netroots" are irrational and allergic to facts.  I do not know Mr. Domenech; I am sure he is a swell fellow, that his writing and reasoning skills are otherwise top-notch, and that his committment to the movement is genuine.  I also know that I would not be having the opportunity to post here without Mr. Domenech's founding hand.

However, an unbiased observer will quickly conclude that Mr. Domenech plagiarized.  It is clear.  And for the life of me, I cannot understand how he thought he would ever get away with this.  After what happened to Blair (on which Mr. Domenech opined!)?  After seeing the power of the blogosphere force Dan Rather into retirement?  Seriously, what was Mr. Domenech thinking?

It is the right that now appears devoid of reason and having a curious disregard for the facts, not the netroots.  Mr. Domenech took the ideas and opinions of other people and led others to believe they were his own.  I am certain he is a fine writer on his own merits, but this overshadows that, and Mr. Domenech should have known this would happen, and for the sake of the movement, kindly turned down the offer to blog for WaPo.

Loyalty is a big deal for me, too.  It's led me to criticize the Administration on two occasions where I felt they needed to show loyalty to people who took major risks to assist this country.

Put aside the left blogosphere for a moment.  They're not revealing something new with Ben that they have not already revealed in the past 3-4 years.

The left blogosphere is merely the online representation of Hillary Clinton's character assasination politics employed explicitly to NEVER DEFEND against any charges.

Focus on Ben for Ben.  The charges revealed required an explanation.  Ben's already addressed a handful of them in his "Red America" post today.  However, he is going to face questions from editors at the Post, his college newspaper and National Review in the coming weeks.

I'm not going to suggest what Ben should do.  He needs to communicate with his editors at the post.

I agree with JustMe in general about some of the reasons people "borrow" from others in the course of learning how to write more effectively, and it's looking more and more, at least to this observer, that Ben was set up by the Washington Post to take this fall.  I find it hard to believe they'd bring him on as a blogger without having someone checking his past work for originality and veracity.  Unfortunately, unless he can come up with a good explanation for why he so liberally "borrowed" other people's words, apparantely without attribution, on so many different occasions, I think he's toast at the WaPo and this is really a black eye for RedState.

Conservatives, especially in the current political climate, are destined to be held to much higher standards of conduct than anyone else.  The investigation of their work is henceforth going to extend retroactively to almost everything they've ever written, no matter how "fluffy" or inconsequential.  That's the world we live in now:  it's a giant game of "gotcha."  Ben should have realized this if he indeed "borrowed" anything verbatim from anyone and posted it to the web.

I don't have the time to investigate the work of other journalists, bloggers and pundits whose opinions I disagree with to determine how many of them are guilty of the same sort of "borrowing."  The larger point is that we live in a connected world where practically everything you say or do in a public forum is going to be recorded for posterity.  The liberals have a lot of people with a lot of time on their hands to go and hunt down every single example of malfeasance or apparently shoddy work.  Finally, I agree with Von.  The fact that they tried six or seven different lines of attack before they found the one that worked gives everyone a fair idea of the kind of people we're fighting against.  But it cannot refute the charge.  Only Ben can do that, to whatever extent he still can.

And if someone at the WaPo or in the WaPo grapevine did indeed set Ben up for this public flogging and humiliation, they sicken me.  If true, and Ben has so few friends at the WaPo who might have tipped him off to the broadside, and this was done to cut him off at the kneecaps, it really shows how sick and retributive and vituperative the world has become.

Look, I hate writing this.  I hate it because it aligns me with the loathsome, ravening moonbats who were, as you point out, on a search-and-destroy mission from the start.  But it needs to be said anyway: Domenech/Augustine is shamefully, utterly guilty of serial plagiarism.  Would that it were not so.  But clearly, from the examples I've read (not just in an old student newspaper, but in his National Review article as well), it is indeed so.  

I cannot defend this.  And I cannot look kindly upon others who would defend this either, unless it's in terms of "yes he's a plagiarist, BUT..."  I won't agree with any justification that would ever be offered after the "BUT," but at least there's no intellectual dishonesty there.

Moreover, I can never look upon his writings the same way again.  Plagiarism is, in my opinion, the ONLY unforgivable sin for people who use words.  Nicking clever ideas, even a turn of the phrase here and there...that's disreputable, but I can let it slide.  Full-scale plagiarism on the level that has been demonstrated by Obsidian Wings (and in other places) is a capital offense, however. It's something I've always considered to be the most depraved intellectual crime one can commit against another.  I know why people plagiarize, I know the temptations, I know the frustration of finding that someone else has said something far more eloquently than you could hope to yourself...but you must resist nonetheless.  Failure to do so makes you no better than a common thief.

I really wish I didn't have to write this.  Surely it won't make me popular here.  And please do note (check my post history) that I'm no troll. This breaks my heart.  I hate handing the slavering morons on the Left a victory like this.  In fact, I feel the same way I felt about Jack Ryan in the Illinois 2004 Senate race: I'm angry at Domenech, because he had no business accepting this job at the Post knowing he'd committed such grave sins, knowing they would inevitably be exposed as the Left came after him (this was as predictable as the sun rising), and placing himself in a position to reflect discredit upon RedState and the online conservative movement in general.  Thanks for nothing.

The examples I've seen of Ben's plagarism are serious and widespread.  I hate taking the word of leftie sites, but I didn't have to -- some of the posters left links to the originals. The evidence of repeated lifting of others' work is damning.

I find two things particularly dismaying about this series of events:

1. Several of the plagarisms occured during Ben's tenure as editor of the William & Mary student paper. Like the school I attended, William & Mary has an honor code, which requires that students pledge their word that they have not lied or cheated.  (Wording varies across honor codes, but that's the gist of it.)  "The honor system is based upon the premise that a person's honor is his or her most cherished attribute."  (This is from the W & M code.) My business success is 100% dependent on this cherished attribute, and I'd rather sweep floors with my reputation intact than do deals with it sullied.
   
2. I believe what has led to the success of conservativism, and what has put it head and shoulders above liberalism, is its richness of ideas.  (See my handle!)  And in the marketplace of ideas, plagarism is shoplifting, plain and simple.

I usually don't pay much attention to leftie blogs, and I don't acknowledge this as their triumph, but rather as Ben's defeat.  I hope Ben does the honorable thing and steps down, and the WaPo lives up to their commitment to providing conservative commentary.  So who's going to step up to provide this voice of reason?  

Just because 9 of the 10 charges were baseless, doesnt mean he gets a pass on the one that is true ..

Do you all remember the Jeff Gannon incident last February, "Gannongate" as the Kossacks called it .. They leveled charge after charge at him after he asked a "softball" question of the President until they found one that was true, and it ruined him .. It didnt matter that the first 10 were lies, the 11th destroyed him and Talon News ...

Michael

kos smelled blood and they got it .. Ben has resigned his position from the WaPo.

Jim Brady has posted a statement on the WaPo website ..

Its over

Michael

Boy, is that a laugh.  This coming from the party that has a vehicular murderer and a KKK Kleagle on its Senate side of the aisle. Don't also forget you also have a proven plagarist, Joe Biden. Yet not one of these guys have stepped down from the job.

How many Democrats still accept money and take marching orders from Markos "Screw-em", despite the fact that he ridiculed contractors as they were being burned and mutilated? That obnoxious site also accused our troops, incorrectly, of using chemical weapons.

If you look into anybody's past with a microscope, everybody will have some indiscretions.  Even Martin Luther King plagarize part of his dissertation paper.

If he is guilty of borrowing phrases without attributing, he should simply apologize and continue in his job.

But thanks for rubbing in some salt on a drive-by.

And I promise you they won't stop there.

It's not just the Gannons of the world who are the targets. It's fundamentally decent guys like Ben. If it can happen to him, it can happen to any of you.

Folks, motives matter. I will defer to Augustine/Ben for a fuller accounting. But there's no denying that the charges here were borne of a blindering hatred -- the strange notion that a lone voice needed to be destroyed for daring to have a blog.

Compare this to Dan Rather, Jayson Blair, and Jack Kelly all you'd like. But the simple fact is that we didn't bring their families into this. We didn't need insults and expletives to bring them down. Conservatives conducted themselves honorably in these situations, by focusing on their conduct as professional journalists, and no more.

That is sadly not the case with the left and Ben Domenech.

Shame.

going to probably die, or if it does survive they will choose somebody the "left" likes, which in effect means the conservative voice will likely be less than conservative.

If they choose another actual conservative, the left attack dogs will start again, and somebody else gets to resign.

Now there may be tons more allegations out there than what I have seen so far, but I still am not convinced that it means he should have been forced to resign.

the power of leftist smears. Among people they've recently tried to paint as prejudiced, authoritarian monsters are two who now write opinions from the bench of SCOTUS. Unfortunately, there was substance in the flurry of nonsense, and that was what ultimately carried the day.

No amount of misbehavior from the far left can ever make the plagiarism stuff right.  

To maintain any sort of integrity, we need to live but the standards we set for ourselves. If we can't do that much, we're no better than the far left loonies are.

...if they used this as an excuse to get rid of Red America.

If the WaPo has any integrity at all (and I honestly think it does), they should at this moment feel very strongly that Red America must go on -- even if they should decide that Ben has to go.

it seems to be "man did a horrible thing" (and by the tone of the left you would think he was an axe murderer), and should forever be punished for it, no jobs for him, he should be fired from all of them etc etc etc.

Which is why I asked where it stops.  At what point do we forgive and let somebody move on?  

And the way this all went down, just doesn't sit well with me.  

left, it wasn't to catch a plagiarizer, it was to kill the blog itself.  They didn't start with Plagiarizing, they started by picking apart every post the man ever made, and then finally hit some paydirt.

The goal wasn't just to get rid of Ben, but the blog itself.

The goal, I suspect in the end will prove met, and Red America likely won't come back.  I also suspect they won't actually choose a conservative, but somebody the left likes, which means they are a sort of conservative.

But there are principles at stake here. One of the most attractive things about the modern conservative movement is that its stands are principled. I'd be disappointed to see the movement abandoning those principles -- even to protect a friend.

Let the punishment fit the crime, though.

Trust me, nobody less likes seeing the left getting fuel for its assinine behavior than I do. It's a shame that they are going to feel so good about this.

But that doesn't change a thing as far as I'm concerned. Principles matter.

I'm reminded of this quote from one of my favorite all time movies, Broadcast News.

What do you think the Devil is going to look like if he's around? Nobody is going to be taken in if he has a long, red, pointy tail. No. I'm semi-serious here. He will look attractive and he will be nice and helpful and he will get a job where he influences a great God-fearing nation and he will never do an evil thing... he will just bit by little bit lower standards where they are important. Just coax along flash over substance... Just a tiny bit.

I don't know if Ben is the devil here or the collective left, but letting either a person or a set of events lower your standards is simply not the way to go here.

AT what point does the left have enough blood?

At what point is there forgiveness?

And frankly 24 is still pretty stinking young.  It feels like a life time ago for me, and I would hate to have every thing I did at 24, or 18, or 17 held against me forever.

quite a few of us feel otherwise and rather strongly. Friends aren't chips.

I have never said otherwise.  (Loyalty is among my vices, too.)  

Give it time.  You're too close to this one.

Perhaps you don't recall that during the 2000 Republican primary, Bush decided to go after McCain's family.

The McCain family adopted a girl that they found in a Bangladeshi orphanage run by Mother Teresa. The Bush team first had to decide how to distort the facts. The girl had dark skin, so they decided to appeal to racist instincts by pretending that the girl was black. They also decided to claim illegitimate, bringing in the issues of misogeny and adultery.

Then the Bush team had to decide how to plant the story. That was easy: they commissioned a poll which asked people: "Would you be more likely or less likely to vote for John McCain for president if you knew he had fathered an illegitimate black child?"

"The character assassins must be defeated. Completely and utterly defeated."

Somehow, I suspect that if you had spent the last five years saying that, "Bush must be defeated, completely and utterly defeated," you wouldn't be writing posts on redstate.org.

Move along.

This dead horse has been beat and beat over and over.

It has NOTHING to do with the current topic of discussion.  It is nothing but an attempt to throw feces our way.

That's not a suggestion.

I have some remaining steam to toss off. Never mind. Bye.

Much better.

doesn't it feel better to use your BLAM for good, instead of revenge?  ;>]

And twice only, have I banned someone with whom I was locked in debate.

I can't help it so many people try to act so stupid.

Some things just come naturally.